Are we really accepting and inclusive?

I first joined stonewall fleet over two years ago, because I was thrilled to find an accepting and inclusive fleet that doesn't make a habit out of using language that is disparaging against one group or another.

In the last few months tho, that seems to have changed. It's almost every day that I am on fleet chat and see something from somebody that comes across sexist, misogynistic, homocentric, or even downright offensive.

We are not a fleet for gay guys, we are a fleet for everybody, and it's simply not appropriate for us to allow all the woman hating and straight hating that goes on in fleet chat.

I find it hard to believe that I am the only one to be bothered by this. What can we do to bring things back in line with our purpose.

Taken from the homepage of our site:

Stonewall Fleet makes Gene Roddenberry's vision of a future where humans are equal and free of prejudice a reality. While our mission is to explore strange new worlds, to seek out new civilizations and to boldly go where no one has gone before, our mandate is to create a fleet to carry out this mission in a manner that respects all human rights and welcomes everyone with open arms.

I honestly do not think ive seen that, mabye im not paying enough attention. Is it a particular group of people perhapse?

I mean, we can get kinda heated and push the edge when we are having aggressive negotiations in chat, but it seems to cool off pretty much. I just think that the majority of our topics have to deal with Homosexual Male things, as thats what alot of us are. But I can not recall any anti-feminism or hetrophobia while im online.

but honestly mate, if you see that then quash it, or grab another one of us or all of us. I dont think many of the good people would tolerate that kind of nonsense if they realized what it was.

Quote by The Seacat

but honestly mate, if you see that then quash it, or grab another one of us or all of us. I dont think many of the good people would tolerate that kind of nonsense if they realized what it was.

I did that, and was asked to not talk about it in fleet chat, to only talk about it on the forums. Nobody seemed to think I had a leg to stand on. Sigh. I just left the fed fleet and alt fleet, but still have my main in the house of nagh red.

I'm at work but wanted to respond, I do see your point fleet chat dosent always reflect our fleets collective values, and this is more then worth talking about. You'be added a lot of value to this fleet, if this upsets you enough to post here, it matters to me. What would you like to see?

Sent form my HTC One S(The ONE to rule them all)

Quote by Six-of-Nine

Quote by The Seacat

but honestly mate, if you see that then quash it, or grab another one of us or all of us. I dont think many of the good people would tolerate that kind of nonsense if they realized what it was.

I did that, and was asked to not talk about it in fleet chat, to only talk about it on the forums. Nobody seemed to think I had a leg to stand on. Sigh. I just left the fed fleet and alt fleet, but still have my main in the house of nagh red.

The reason why I asked you not to, is because the user whose comments you were offended by did profusely apologise for any offence caused. Personally, I think that should hve been the end of it in fleet chat, but I got the impression you were like a dog with a bone over the issue, even after I tried to steer the conversation away. You may have a point, you have every right to counter any offence caused by someone, but I dont believe fleetchat should be used as a vehicle for this for hours on end leaving all parties and spectators awkward, upset or angry. I havent personally witnessed the stuff youve brought up by othrr fleet mates, but I do believe if any serious offence is caused it should be investigated. Which is why bringing it privately to other mods/admins is the way to go..imo :)

Josh you have to admit this is a little far fetched. You have a tendency to say things in that chat that many people do not want to hear, but while some mind others do not because it is a +PG 13 channel after all. People are allowed to speak their minds in regards to issues even if you or anyone else disagrees with them. There can be out right vulgarity there and prejudiced, but at the end of the day everyone is entitled to their own opinion and having their own way of saying it.

People in the channel should remember it is PG 13 at the end of the day and should phrase things in a more polite manor, but it is a game with no real life consequences so people want to be open. We can tell people to be more respectful with what they say, but at the end of the day it's all down to personal opinion. Unless people are being out right rude giving abusive language we shouldn't be censoring what people say. Have you seen the rest of STO's channels? I though we were a fleet of gay guys, women, transgendered? Being an LGBT fleet, but that doesn't disallow straight members who I notice take part in these chats quite a lot. These topics aren't gay half the time it's just general topics with a gay twist i reckon :P

I've been on and not seen much of this, but I do know it can happen. When it occasionally does happen I just remind them it's pg13 and they stop it. In fact don't realize they went overboard.

You were an officer and you know we can't always control what goes on Chat nor would be want to. Freedom of speech dude, gotta deal with it.

Quote by Sixu

I dont believe fleetchat should be used as a vehicle for this for hours on end leaving all parties and spectators awkward, upset or angry.

I don't play STO very often at all, any more; but when I do, I've seen stuff in fleet chat that's made me switch to a PM window or /clear the window. Stuff that made me feel awkward and/or upset enough to stop the scroll of text. I never said anything about it, I just switch windows or /clear the box.

I suppose I should say something, but then I wonder if I have any right to. Perhaps I've said things in the past that made people feel awkward or upset but no one ever told me. So, I feel that the best option is for me to simply look away and let s/he who is without sin cast the stone. :p

omg, i seriously hope this isn't just about a comment i made clearly in fun earlier this evening.

my comment "ugh, did someone say vaginal"
explanation: when i logged on there was this conversation ongoing about "breeders" and reproduction. someone referenced vaginal intercourse . . .

then i was called a hater . . .

i restated that i love women just not their lady parts . . .

more yelling at me . . .

i apologize . . .

more yelling . . .

i apologize again . . .

threats to quit the fleet . . .

really, AGAIN, if my comment offended I SINCERELY APOLOGIZE. But I never anticipated that comment would really set anyone off.

Quote by Primantine

omg, i seriously hope this isn't just about a comment i made clearly in fun earlier this evening.

my comment "ugh, did someone say vaginal"
explanation: when i logged on there was this conversation ongoing about "breeders" and reproduction. someone referenced vaginal intercourse . . .

then i was called a hater . . .

i restated that i love women just not their lady parts . . .

more yelling at me . . .

i apologize . . .

more yelling . . .

i apologize again . . .

threats to quit the fleet . . .

really, AGAIN, if my comment offended I SINCERELY APOLOGIZE. But I never anticipated that comment would really set anyone off.

I never meant to specifically call out you as a person, there were 2-3 people saying things that made me uncomfortable. I didn't feel that you ever owed me an apology in the first place, my complaints are more about the overall tone that I've seen things take, not you or anybody else.

I never meant anything to come across as yelling, though I probably did get a bit defensive when I felt that everybody was ganging up on me.

Quote by Primantine

omg, i seriously hope this isn't just about a comment i made clearly in fun earlier this evening.

my comment "ugh, did someone say vaginal"
explanation: when i logged on there was this conversation ongoing about "breeders" and reproduction. someone referenced vaginal intercourse . . .

then i was called a hater . . .

i restated that i love women just not their lady parts . . .

more yelling at me . . .

i apologize . . .

more yelling . . .

i apologize again . . .

threats to quit the fleet . . .

really, AGAIN, if my comment offended I SINCERELY APOLOGIZE. But I never anticipated that comment would really set anyone off.

You are allowed to state a topic in fleet chat. If someone was uncomfortable they should have stated it or contact a FC or Office when they were on. We can not police that channel 24/7 and I like lady parts to as well as the lady so I don't see anything wrong with that personally. If gay member of the fleet are uncomfortable with conversation about lady parts they should remember that people, possibly our straight members, maybe uncomfortable with talking about boy parts. It works both ways and if people were kicking off about that then they should realize this.

I'm not condoning explicate content in chat, but there is a line, from the explicate to an opinion. It's a judgement call and with the amount of people in fleet chat it's hard to set a standard when we have many different personalities and backgrounds. Everyone needs to relax and not take these things as a personal attack. If it's outlandish contact one of us or simply withdraw yourself from the conversation. There is no need to get involved if your not happy with it. The same rule applies to spoilers from the featured episodes.

Dependent on the way the conversation was brought up one of us may have got involved, but we aren't a nanny state. So don't worry about that far worst has been said in chat.

We have straight members?

Quote by Six-of-Nine

Nobody seemed to think I had a leg to stand on. Sigh.

That is simply not true. I sent you a tell at the time saying that I agreed that the particular comment that was made was not appropriate and that you were right to say so. Several other people also made supportive statements.

Completely aside from the issue of whether or not fleet chat was the appropriate place to have the discussion, your suggestion that EVERYBODY was against you is just not the case. On the question of whether the comment was appropriate, I thought you had a leg to stand on, and I said so to you at the time.

So I've been considering this over night, and I think perhaps I'm just more sensitive to these issues than most people are.

I was having an especially bad day, and I let my feelings get hurt and felt ganged up on, but I'm now realizing that was likely in my head to a great extent.

I know that we all mean to be open and accepting, and sometimes we just don't show it the same way.

I am sorry to anybody that I upset.

RE Matt: Yes, we have members who are straight, gay, bi, lesbian, queer, trans, male, female, and probably a few other variants.

Quote by Six-of-Nine

So I've been considering this over night, and I think perhaps I'm just more sensitive to these issues than most people are.

I was having an especially bad day, and I let my feelings get hurt and felt ganged up on, but I'm now realizing that was likely in my head to a great extent.

I know that we all mean to be open and accepting, and sometimes we just don't show it the same way.

I am sorry to anybody that I upset.

RE Matt: Yes, we have members who are straight, gay, bi, lesbian, queer, trans, male, female, and probably a few other variants.

We are all entitle to our bad days, and I'm sorry you had having one.

Great that we were able to resolve this. Thread is locked.